Orem

***“Hector,” a MAGA person, at work in the author’s bathroom.***

I didn’t know, or care, who Charlie Kirk was until Tuesday afternoon, Sept. 9, 2025. I had just given myself a shot of Dupixent (for my skin condition), and was flipping through some YouTube videos when I came across a whole bunch of people fleeing a campus somewhere in Utah. The headline said somebody named Charlie Kirk, apparently another repulsive conservative firebrand, had just been shot in the neck by an apparent sharpshooter some 175 yards away, which is a pretty good shot, IMHO. And I don’t shoot anything — except pictures.

So another conservative asshole (real Republicans, like Barry Goldwater or William F. Buckley, having gone extinct when MAGA replaced them) preaching racism, sexism, religious intolerance and other SHIT, PURE UNADULTERATED BULLSHIT, to the delightfully uneducated, according to Herr Drumpf. Good riddance! Why should I care?

(NOTE: If you want a fact-check on what CK did/did not say, go here: https://generik.substack.com/p/fact-checking-charlie-kirks-awfulness)

And then, a thought struck me rather hard: What are the conservative podcasters saying?

And then, a thought struck me rather hard: What are conservative commentators saying?

I watched about five of them, and they were all saying the same thing: “WE ARE NOW AT WAR WITH THE LIBERALS! CHARLIE, OUR BELOVED LI’L CHARLIE, WAS OBVIOUSLY ASSASSINATED BY A WOKE, LEFT-WING LIBERAL LUNATIC SPOUTING TRANSEXUAL DOGMA! ALL LIBERALS DESERVE TO DIE!!!”

Well! That sure got my attention! Especially when El Presidente T.A.C.O. added his stamp of official outrage to the overflowing hate blender! https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Sa_Cp9fwBoc

Let me tell you, after that I was quaking in my boots, size 8-1/2 waffle stompers! But what could I, one lonely, radical democratic socialist-futurist zoophile do to “lower the temperature,” as the politicos put it, other than turn down the thermostat on my new central air conditioner and handler, installed after a year of sweltering heat by Charlotte County Human Services, Family Services Center? How could I, a specialist in public relations, use my talents to get the message out that I, and other liberals, didn’t kill Charlie Kirk, had no plans to do so, and were now being blamed for his murder with absolutely no proof except that most liberal commentators had called him on his Krakatoa of pure hatred, intolerance and bullshit?

I’ll let you in on a little secret: I know a MAGA! And we were, for a while, kinda, sorta, friendly. For a while.

I didn’t realize this guy was a slavering MAGA type at first, he seemed almost normal. He owns two houses, one out near where I used to live, in a trailer on Swaying Palm Drive in Punta Gorda. As a matter of fact, he and my friend Dave are next-door neighbors! And then he built, and owns, and usually stays at, a house on the block behind me. I don’t want to identify him, so I’ll just call him Hector, which I assure you is not his name and never has been.

My knowledge of Hector was casual, until about 6 months ago, when a couple of conversations revealed the depth of his dexterous (meaning right-handed) political affiliations. That was a strike against him. On the plus side, Hector, who made his living giving totally upfront massages (you have to be licensed in Florida) and small home repairs, could provide me with trips to the nearest store when it was too hot outside to ride my tricycle. He also was a bed-time stoner, who smoked pot only because (he claimed) it helped him get to sleep. Me, I smoke pot to stay awake, but whatever, Hector proved to be a rather generous fellow who didn’t mind loaning me a little money now and then to replenish my, and his, stash. Although we had a couple of rather strident arguments about politics, we both managed by mutual consent to mostly stay away from that topic, so I found it a rather convenient relationship, from my point of view. And my strident defense of liberalism, the validity of the press at large, and equal rights for all was at least being heard — but sometimes it just amused Hector no end, and once he laughed in my face. I left immediately, but I was steamed.

At that point, I told him, “You can own me, or we can be friends. Which is it?” And it seemed like he chose to be friends. And everything was daffodils and unicorns between me and Hector… until dumb old Charlie Kirk got himself killed, just as he was answering a question about gun violence in America (Kirk being of the distinctly minority opinion that a few mass shootings every now and then are a small, and worthwhile, price to pay for the 2nd Amendment!).

So what follows is a text conversation I had with Hector the day Kirk was shot. I am presenting it as it went, without editing or editorializing. I think every word, both Hector’s and mine, speak clearly for our differences in opinions and values. We were raised very differently (hell, my raising was different from just about EVERYBODY ELSE), and we have different life experiences and different ways of confronting stress and solving our problems. What I think Hector’s responses make clear is his existence in a bubble where there is only one reliable news source: THE WHITE HOUSE! They inform Faux News, which repeats it into the echo chamber of the right-wing Blog-O-Sphere, which reiterates slight truths, half-truths and damnable falsehoods with equal vigor and certitude! So here it is, my last attempt a a sane, sober and rational conversation with a MAGA cultist… because that’s what they are. The conversation begins in the afternoon, while Hector was out at a massage, and picks up there.

Me, Thursday 9:01 a.m. Good morning. I just wanted to let you know, I didn’t shoot Charley (sic) Kirk!

Me, 2:28 p.m., after watching more videos: Charlie.

Me, 4:34 p.m. Hey, give me a call when you’re home? I find Kirk’s murder very disturbing, and what’s being said about it, even more disturbing.

Hector, 5:41 p.m. I am home. And yes the whole thing from the beginning to the end is disturbing and I cannot believe that anybody connected with any of these people would maintain any kind of a friendship they are absolute ghouls and have no respect for anybody’s life because you disagree with what they’re saying!!!!! The Democratic party has turned out to be the party of death and destruction, chaos and barbarism and they think somebody who is a father and a husband who just got murdered is a feather in their hat there’s a lot of mental health in that group and the Democrats have done nothing but encourage it!!! Everyone that isn’t any position of power in the Democratic party has called Donald Trump a Hitler, a fascist, a racist, a communist and at this point I want Donald Trump to designate the Democratic party as a terror group!!!! One person and only one person died at the Capitol that was spurred on by Nancy pelosi who actually admitted she was ultimately responsible for that Trump had called for the national guard the day before and she refused to do it. The one person who died was shot by a capital police man who wasn’t identified until 2 years later the person he shot and killed was Ashley Bobbitt but the Democratic party just keeps repeating the lies that they know are lies and stirring up the retarded people who will do their bidding for them. The conservatives are at a turning point and we’re on the edge of a civil war and it won’t be the north against the South it will be neighbor against neighbor based solely on what they believe. Has the saying goes it’s not all of them but it’s always them!!

And yes I am pissed he was a good man and people laugh about this and encourage more of this behavior!

I cannot think of one time where there was a MAGA Mass shooter the liberals seem to prop up all of their mentally ill retards and have them do their dirty work and say “It’s because of MAGA”

You’re (sic) idiot leaders thin that men stand for trans women and men can menstruate and men can get pregnant! They didn’t kill him for his hate preach they killed him for speech and they hated!

Me, in reply: Hector, I’m a Democrat, and what you are hearing about Democrats is doing what President Trump intended it to do: making you mad at somebody, when we don’t even know what political persuasion the shooter was or who he was. Most of the shooters at President Trump if you remember or (sic) Republicans. Who did not agree with him over something. my life and my job when I had one were devoted to freedom of speech. I don’t believe in killing people because you don’t like their ideas, I believe in putting forth better ideas in better language. So please calm down and let’s talk about this if we can?

Do you remember Donald Trump saying he could shoot somebody on fifth Avenue and not get arrested for it? Remembering to pay the lawyer’s bills of people at his rallies who beat up protesters? The Democrats have not been the source of the violence here Hector. It was not Mitch McConnell’s wife who got hit over the head with a hammer, but Nancy Pelosi’s husband.

Hector, in reply: (REPEATS FIRST TWO PARAGRAPHS, ABOVE.)

Me, in reply: But, you are responding exactly the way Trump wants you to. So if you believe that’s a good thing, more power to you. I don’t. Because it frightens me to be accused of something I never did, never felt, and don’t believe in.

Hector, in reply: The Democrats were the first ones to center speech using the internet and the FBI went to Mark Zuckerberg and told them what could be allowed to be said and what not to be said pretty much anything that somebody who was a conservative was silenced from day one of Joe biden’s sad presidency

Me, in reply: I had absolutely no idea who Charlie Kirk was or what he stood for until yesterday afternoon.

Hector, in reply: (REPEATS THIRD PARAGRAPH, ABOVE.)

Trump has no influence on how I feel it’s called the difference between right and wrong Charlie Kirk was executed and murdered and yesterday they started dancing on his grave and making fun of him if I was a Democrat I would dis associate myself from that

(REPEATS FOURTH PARAGRAPH, ABOVE.)

Me, in reply: Untrue. Zuckerberg has loosened his standards because conservatives claim they were being censored! Do they own social media? Zuckerberg does, and as the owner, you can post whatever he wants up there. Total untruths if he wants them. He chose to publish a lot of information or to allow others to publish the information. I shouldn’t say that was profoundly negative about Trump. And conservatives didn’t like it. And they basically forced Zuckerberg who you remember was standing behind Trump at his inauguration to give them a platform to spread their “news,” which is product predominantly half truth and hate.

All the Democrats I have heard have publicly expressed shock and outrage at this murder! Democrats as a party have long stood for freedom of speech, even unpopular speech because unpopular speech is the most important kind.

If you could name any of the sites or tell me what sites have shown Democrats making fun of this or trivializing it or using it as a political weapon please tell me because I would like to see who is doing this. It would outrage me too if I knew that some Democrats were doing it because I’ve heard just the oppositefrom people I trust in the news.

In the conservative commentary, I have heard about this. I haven’t heard any Democrats making fun of it laughing at it trivializing it or using it as a political weapon. I’ve heard lots of Republicans condemning Democrats and saying that we are now at war with Democrats because they think a Democrat did this and I say hold on! Hold on! We Democrats are beginning to sound a lot like the Jews of Nazi Germany and that makes me very, very frightened.

Hector, in reply: You have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about you’re just another Democratic zombie whatever the party says that’s what you believe I was outside painting a house and it was all unfolding when they de platformed Trump that’s why he created truth social and that was on and that was on… Unfortunately I do not remember the name of that platform anymore. But I can tell you you’re absolutely wrong the FBI went to Mark Zuckerberg and later on he had to admit that they had done that!

Me, in reply: Please site (sic) a new story I can read about it? Who did Z admit it to?

Hector, in reply: No the Democrats are sounding exactly like Hitler in Nazi Germany it was just like the movie 1984 with the ministry of Truth. (NOTE: Hector and I watched several feature films together, and the 1950’s British production of Orwell’s 1984, which he’d heard of but never seen nor read the book, was the next to last one. The last one? Kubrick’s Paths of Glory.)

Me, in reply: The Democrats are not in power, my friend.

Hector, in reply: He admitted that the FBI had come to him and asked him forcefully to (remove from? — MJB) the platform Trump and any Trump supporters

Me, in reply: Source?

Hector, in reply: I’m not saying anybody that I know can control these morons but you have to at least see that it’s their rhetoric that is causing all of these problems!

I will Google that.

Me, in reply: I don’t, sadly. Not with my president declaring war on my political party, NO.

And they aren’t morons, they’re people just like you except they have different ideas about what makes America great.

The only thing that matters to me about what Trump says is that you’re swallowing it whole. Again, you swallow camels, and choke on gnats. You need to stop & think carefully about what you are saying.

No the Democrats are sounding exactly like Hitler in Nazi Germany it was just like the movie 1984 with the ministry of Truth.

He admitted that the FBI had come to him and asked him forcefully to the platform Trump and any Trump supporters

(NOTE: It was only while reformatting this conversation for the Web that I realized Hector is repeating the same words, phrases and paragraphs many times! This makes his argument seem longer than it really is, but it also makes him seem like a photocopy machine, and I wonder what was going through his head! Did he think he could bludgeon me with his rants if he repeated them often enough?)

Me, in reply: Democrats don’t time-travel, either. And if Donald Trump worked for the FBI to expose Epstein, there should be a dossier of everything that he discovered so let’s see it? Where is it? Why isn’t he being celebrated for exposing a pedophile? Oh, he didn’t expose a pedophile. My bad!

Hector, in reply: I’m not saying anybody that I know can control these morons but you have to at least see that it’s their rhetoric that is causing all of these problems!

I will Google that.

Me, in reply: Think hard before you speak, Hector. Remember, RU-TV (the government-controlled Russian TV network) happily reported Russian foreign minister Sergei Lavrov cheerfully announced that Tulsi Gabbard are now working for them, but I’ve never gotten any checks from Moscow.

Hector, in reply: It was Twitter not Google or Facebook and they’re not people like me I certainly wouldn’t put myself in a position where I would go to jail for anything for anybody

Me, in reply: Tulsi & Trump, in fact.

I wouldn’t call Twitter, a reliable source for any news at all.

Hector, not repeating himself: Once again they cheerfully report their narrative. But Facebook did cover up the hunter Biden laptop that happened to come up when I was looking up the other thing

Trump hasn’t really said anything controversial at all since Charlie Kirk got shot

Me, in reply: So which Democrat is making fun of CK’s murder? Hubs (Hunter Biden’s) laptop is a very dead issue, as his dad isn’t president anymore.

But, he can still live rent free in Trump’s head! And have you seen his face today? It looks like he’s had a stroke which is affected the right side of his face. My mother had these strokes, and I recognize the expression.

The only people Trump can forgive for committing actual crimes are the 1500 who attacked the capital (sic) building on January 6. They’re the only ones who have ever had anything resembling sympathy from him and a lot of of them, I hear, have been re-arrested for various crimes. Not a great argument for their virtue. And remember, they were ready to hang Mike Pence for the simple reason that he disagreed with Trump. Hang Mike Pence. Hang Mike Pence! Think about it. Think about it.

Hector, in reply: It was Twitter not Google or Facebook and they’re not people like me I certainly wouldn’t put myself in a position where I would go to jail for anything for anybody

(This is getting creepy! I don’t believe this file on my computer has been tampered with, the idea is pretty absurd, but I don’t remember this much sheer repetition in Hector’s messages when I was reading them the first time! The content seems to have been replaced, but I was emotionally wrought and may not be remembering them clearly. I am not putting any words into Hector’s mouth, just copying and pasting the conversation from what is in my Messages folder.)

Me, in reply: And remember all those Republicans you were so upset after the attack on the capital building? They fell right into line and kissed Trump’s ass at the first available opportunity because they were scared that they would lose their six figure jobs and all their perks if they lost an election and then they’d have to do some honest work. Which doesn’t seem to suit conservatives well at all. They prefer to make their money off people like you and me working hard for them. Don’t you see?

Hector, in reply: Once again they cheerfully report their narrative. But Facebook did cover up the hunter Biden laptop that happened to come up when I was looking up the other thing

Trump hasn’t really said anything controversial at all since Charlie Kirk got shot

The Democrats have had the Epstein files for 4 years or so if there was anything in there about Donald Trump it would have been exposed. Look up the moment of silence for Charlie Kirk which turns into a shouting match on the house floor, that’s pretty disgusting (I did, CK got his moment of silence without interruption. Afterward, some Congresswoman began shouting what an ass he was, but she was just telling the truth. Causing minor disorder on the floor of Congress, guilty.)

And yes there were some people there at the Capitol that did commit crimes but there were a lot of people there who are ushered in by the capital police it had nothing to do with that riot and they got their lives ruined

Me, in reply: You’re assuming that the Democrats have the same values as the Republican Party/MAGA, which they don’t. Epstein was dead. Maxwell was in jail and Biden probably had more pressing problems to deal with at the time. Like the war in Ukraine. Or Israel bombing Gaza to smithereens. Little things like that. Besides it’s been the Republicans who have been chanting about the Epstein files because they thought a lot of Democrats would get swept up in them. Surprise! The leopard eats your face too!

You again believe a lie. Have you ever watched the whole thing? The whole riot? Those people were enraged as they marched towards the capital and the capital police tried their hardest to stop them and they got beaten and crushed and bear sprayed for their efforts two of them I believe died And the story that they were just there to see the capital is frankly bullshit, Dave, bullshit bullshit, bullshit. And I’m surprised that a smart guy like you can be easily made to believe so much bullshit.

Why is that? Have you got a thing for woman-hating race-baiting riot-inciting pedophiles?

“Funny, you don’t LOOK Jewish…”

Just asking the question.

Hector, in reply: LOL!!

Me, in reply: Glad you’re amused by my ethnic humor. Good night.

Hector, in reply: Thank you for the distraction! You have a good night also!

Me, in reply: Sorry you feel that my need to talk about the murder of a conservative spokesman was a distraction. It’s been more than a distraction to me. Good night again.

Me, continuing: Pelosi has no power over the National Guard in D.C., so what you heard is more BS. The WH waited 5 hours before deploying them. Those are the facts, according to Snopes, which most reporters, Republican & Democrat, depend on for fact-checking.

Me, concluding: I just wanted to tell you it’s too soon to jump to conclusions that investigators haven’t reached yet, but I’m rather glad you want to be by yourself tonight.

See you around.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/pelosi-national-guard-capitol/

Hector, in reply: Are those two snopes things that you showed me we’re simply entertainment! And yes somebody I want to say it was a relative of hers taped her saying that she was ultimately responsible well after the fact

Me, in reply: Prove it. Play the recording for me. Snopes is NOT entertainment, they are the standard for fact-checking in English whether that suits you or not. Another camel you have swallowed, my brother! Don’t you ever get indigestion?

🐪🐪🐪

You’re believing rumors, and you’re not even asking anybody to prove them!

Hector, in reply: On both of those Snopes things you showed me at the end of the article it said there was a lot of hearsay and rumors I did highlight them and I still have them

Me, in reply: Scuttlebutt, innuendo, falsehoods and truly ridiculous things. They fit your narrative, which is why you don’t question them.

Hector, in reply: Google, was Nancy pelosi responsible for deploying the national guard which Donald Trump did ask for a couple of days in advance she was the speaker of the house and it was her responsibility I just read the article although there are conflicting articles the one I was reading was KOMO

Me, in reply: And your narrative, like it or not, is that you in particular and conservatives in general and MAGA, especially, are the victims of a vast conspiratorial underground, dark plot to do away with American values and destroy the country as you knew it. Which is the most preposterous piece of bullshit of all.

Hector, in reply: Yes that’s exactly why Joe Biden crashed the economy and wanted all the illegals in to boost his voter base Governor pritzker just admitted that

Me, in reply: If “destroying the country” means treating white people the same as Black people, brown people, yellow people or red people then yes, we are out to destroy the country. If it means giving women reproductive control over their own bodies, then yes, we are out to destroy the country. If it means replacing sources of energy you’d like cold (sic) and oil is that foul the air Was (with) inexpensive, natural sources of energy, like sunlight and wind, then yes, we are destroying the country. If it means trying to protect the populous from a deadly plague that is threatening us, then that means we are destroying the country. There are many more things we can do to destroy this country. Would you like me to list them?

No, the governor Pritzker did not come, because that’s not what happened.

And it’s totally preposterous of you to say that without giving me further proof of anything.

Hector, in reply: That’s why Governor trickster didn’t want Trump coming in to Chicago he flat said it.

Me, in reply: Of course not. The National Guard fights wars, they aren’t trained to do police work.

Hector, in reply: It’s pretty much all on the internet if you have any interest in looking it up I do have other things I need to get done tonight but thank you for the entertainment, it has made me feel better

Well the carjacking the murders and the crime has certainly gone down in DC and there’s plenty of videos thanking Donald Trump along with the mayor

Me, in reply: Trump threatened him with war. “Apocalypse now!” Why should he welcome that? Trump has taken a hostile view towards a city that is just trying to do the best it can. And I predict that sending the National Guard will only make things worse. But of course, Trump knows everything and he’s always right. So I’m sure this will work out just fine.

Chipocalypse Now.

Again, goodnight. Who will tell you jokes when they take me away?

Goodnight, Hector.

🌔

Hector, in reply: That’s a good point!! As far as the national guard goes and ice goes people who have their documentation aren’t being taken away. These people came here with no due process they go out the same. But they do need to get the crime and the murders down it’s a matter of as they say f*** around and find out!!

Good night! You did make me laugh!! And I really needed that!

Me, in reply: 70% of the residents of Alligator Alcatraz had committed no crimes. And illegal immigrants commit less crimes than natural-born citizens. Why would they? They don’t want to get deported! They want to stay, even tho’ they pay Social Security taxes & don’t get any benefits. Again, THINK, Hector! Your god gave you 3 lbs. of brains, you might want to give them some exercise occasionally.

And if you find what I’m trying to talk with you about funny, then we really have nothing more to talk about. Finally. Good night.

Hector, concluding: Of course they committed crimes they’re here illegally they came in without due process they go out without due process what part of illegal don’t you understand even the people who come here legally angry about this they had to wait they had to go to school they had to do what was required to become a citizen. Under Joe Biden these people were being put up in luxury hotels that they were destroying giving them cell phones, medical Care and on and on and on. While Medicare is going bankrupt and they ruined the housing market and the vacation market pissing and s******* in the streets not to mention the crime and the rape in the murder and where are the actual statistics that says they commit less crime than people who are citizens I hear it being said a lot but I’ve never heard a figure. Oh and furthermore I love petroleum fuel obviously nobody or should I say the general public does not want electric cars they don’t go far enough and where does the electricity come from oh well there goes your electricity bills not to mention the insurance companies wouldn’t allow you to park them in the garage because they were such a fire hazard and once again on and on and on

Me, concluding: You know what?

You don’t know when to shut up.

So I’m telling you, SHUT YOUR FUCKING MOUTH, YOU PIECE OF WHITE TRASH.

I’m done trying to befriend you. And if I ever ask you for any favor, just laugh in my face and tell me how funny I sound.

That last, furious insult, which I could no longer withhold, just tumbled out of me, and I don’t regret it in the least — at least, not yet! But Hector WAS behaving like a piece of “white trash,” that category of low class, low-income Caucasians whose only boast to adequacy in the world, for whatever reason, is that, through no fault of their own, they think they’re better than some other, “lower, lesser,” race. What a shameful thing to have to admit!

So now I no longer visit Hector, nor wave at him when I see him sitting out on the narrow porch of his house, which he boasted that he built. I don’t ask him for rides to Publix, Walmart or Curaleaf, and when I walk Epic, I don’t go down his street anymore. You see, I know Hector has several firearms, and like to boast about how he helps women in threatening domestic violence situations select the right firearm for self-defense. I, on the other hand, own no guns. I do own a very lovely, Sheffield steel replica British WWI Commando dagger, which I purchased to use as an athamé (knife used in Wiccan rituals). But yes, I do know better than to bring a knife to a gun fight.

So there you have it, readers. If you try to reason with a person who has been indoctrinated into the MAGA cult, my experience shows that although they may be friendly to you personally, for whatever reason (I’m half Jewish, and Hector likes Jews and Israel), you must balance that with their rage at the parties they hate (in Hector’s case, Muslims, Blacks, Hispanics and unfaithful women), and live with the realization that these people can turn on a dime, and focus their hate, their rage, and their unjustifiable violence on you.

Please don’t let anything happen to you! Take precautions, carry pepper spray (a cheap, wonderful, non-lethal antipersonnel weapon), be aware of your surroundings. Don’t engage these people, MAGA, at home or on the streets. When they say they are going to war with “left-wing liberal lunatics,” I take them at their word, and you should too. I hope it doesn’t come to this, but my trust in the democratic institutions of America has been trashed by the ruthless Trump Regime and his authoritarian implementation of Plan 2025.

As the famous 1950’s early television documentarian Edward R. Murrow used to sign off, with absolutely no trace of irony, “Good night, and good luck.”

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